GREEN DAY IS THE WORLDS GREATEST BAND YOU DONT EVEN UNDERSTAND THEY FORMED AOUND 1988THEIR MUSIC IS CATCHY FAST AND GREAT DOOKIE WAS REALLY REALLY GOOD BUT WARNINGS PROBABLY JUST AS GOOD PEOPLE SAY TH

GREEN DAY IS THE WORLDS GREATEST BAND YOU DONT EVEN UNDERSTAND THEY FORMED AOUND 1988THEIR MUSIC IS CATCHY FAST AND GREAT DOOKIE WAS REALLY REALLY GOOD BUT WARNING IS PROBABLY JUST AS GOOD PEOPLE SAY THEY HAVE NOT AGED WELL I DISAGREE I TIHNK THAT THEY HAV ENOT AGED WELL I DISAGREE I TIHNK THAT THEY STILL ROCK

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FLAMING LIPS rule!

Nothing indicates that GD sold out. The lyrics and themes have remained the same. If they did sell out, they did it 17 years ago when they signed to a major label. And they kind of had to. Their second album (Kerplunk) was on an indie label, Lookout Records, and sold thousands of units on its release day. The indie couldn't handle the popularity of Green Day. And isn't the point of making music to reach listeners? If you're good at what you do, you cant help the fame that is thrust upon you.

I'll admit, the politics could get annoying sometimes. But, changing "the system" through music is kind of what Punk music is all about. So, it makes sense for a band like Green Day to release American Idiot. And, if you listen to all the layers and vocal harmonies on American Idiot, its quite sophisticated and beautiful.
I hate it when bands go political. It's the ultimate form of selling out.
As I said earlier, changing "the system" through music is what punk music has always been about. So, if anything, Green Day is "keeping it real." To me, selling out (if you even want to use the expression) is to record music which you don't feel passionate about but know the masses will. Its to please others while not pleasing yourself so that you'll receive monetary gains.


OnlyinPinkerton said:
I hate it when bands go political. It's the ultimate form of selling out.
Since when has the system been changed by music?


Kezner32 said:
As I said earlier, changing "the system" through music is what punk music has always been about. So, if anything, Green Day is "keeping it real." To me, selling out (if you even want to use the expression) is to record music which you don't feel passionate about but know the masses will. Its to please others while not pleasing yourself to receive monetary gains.


OnlyinPinkerton said:
I hate it when bands go political. It's the ultimate form of selling out.


Inspired a movement- no; sustained inspiration for a movement? Yes, I believe so.

As far as politics goes, I am throughly convinced of the Herring Model of political parties. The model suggests that your political ideology is chosen at an early age and is reinforced (or justified) as you get older. Assuming this is true ,which I believe it is, why would a band like Green Day, who began as a relate-able band for most everyone between the ages of 15-27, choose to write songs regarding liberal politics and appeal to single base? My guess is that they were fully aware that they had lost touch with their previous age group, and had found a new way to sell records to a new fan base. Switching fan bases with intention to sell more records is, in my opinion, selling out.





j-biebs said:


no political system has ever been directly changed by music, but you can't deny that music can inspire a movement. ever heard of protest songs?

green day is inspiring a new generation of people to think about politics, and i have a hard time faulting anyone for doing that. i have no idea how you'd consider "going political" to mean "selling out." was guthrie a sellout? was dylan a sellout (pre-2000s dylan, at least)? young? springsteen? f****** come on.

OnlyinPinkerton said:
Since when has the system been changed by music?


Kezner32 said:
As I said earlier, changing "the system" through music is what punk music has always been about. So, if anything, Green Day is "keeping it real." To me, selling out (if you even want to use the expression) is to record music which you don't feel passionate about but know the masses will. Its to please others while not pleasing yourself to receive monetary gains.


OnlyinPinkerton said:
I hate it when bands go political. It's the ultimate form of selling out.
FOREVER!

Kezner32 said:
FLAMING LIPS rule!

Nothing indicates that GD sold out. The lyrics and themes have remained the same. If they did sell out, they did it 17 years ago when they signed to a major label. And they kind of had to. Their second album (Kerplunk) was on an indie label, Lookout Records, and sold thousands of units on its release day. The indie couldn't handle the popularity of Green Day. And isn't the point of making music to reach listeners? If you're good at what you do, you cant help the fame that is thrust upon you.

I'll admit, the politics could get annoying sometimes. But, changing "the system" through music is kind of what Punk music is all about. So, it makes sense for a band like Green Day to release American Idiot. And, if you listen to all the layers and vocal harmonies on American Idiot, its quite sophisticated and beautiful.
It probably makes more sense to say that they fell out of the 14-24 year old fan base, slapped on some eyeliner, and sang politically charged songs that appeal to the demographics of their desired base- with the intention of getting back into the base. I don't think you guarantee more record sales when you write about teenage angst at the age of 38, because how do you know the base will agree with you? "You're old! What do you know about growing up in today's world?" At least there is a guarantee that your politically charged songs will appeal to a specific demographic.

Alienating the conservative portion of the 15-27 or 14-24 age group is not leaving too much behind. The 2008 national exit polls showed that 66% of those who voted in the age group of 18-29 voted Democratic. Why wouldn't you tap into the 66% with the risk of alienating a portion of the remaining 32-34%? Seems to make sense to me, especially when you already have a large- devoted- fan base to begin with, who will purchase any s*** you put on a record. It seems like Green Day could only profit from a politically charged album.


j-biebs said:
so you're suggesting they switched from the 15-27 year old fanbase to the liberal portion of that 15-27 year old fanbase to sell more records? how would that guarantee more record sales? a career move that alienates a portion of your potential fanbase hardly makes good business sense.

OnlyinPinkerton said:


Inspired a movement- no; sustained inspiration for a movement? Yes, I believe so.

As far as politics goes, I am throughly convinced of the Herring Model of political parties. The model suggests that your political ideology is chosen at an early age and is reinforced (or justified) as you get older. Assuming this is true ,which I believe it is, why would a band like Green Day, who began as a relate-able band for most everyone between the ages of 15-27, choose to write songs regarding liberal politics and appeal to single base? My guess is that they were fully aware that they had lost touch with their previous age group, and had found a new way to sell records to a new fan base. Switching fan bases with intention to sell more records is, in my opinion, selling out.





j-biebs said:


no political system has ever been directly changed by music, but you can't deny that music can inspire a movement. ever heard of protest songs?

green day is inspiring a new generation of people to think about politics, and i have a hard time faulting anyone for doing that. i have no idea how you'd consider "going political" to mean "selling out." was guthrie a sellout? was dylan a sellout (pre-2000s dylan, at least)? young? springsteen? f****** come on.

OnlyinPinkerton said:
Since when has the system been changed by music?


Kezner32 said:
As I said earlier, changing "the system" through music is what punk music has always been about. So, if anything, Green Day is "keeping it real." To me, selling out (if you even want to use the expression) is to record music which you don't feel passionate about but know the masses will. Its to please others while not pleasing yourself to receive monetary gains.


OnlyinPinkerton said:
I hate it when bands go political. It's the ultimate form of selling out.
"see: weezer. when you have a small, but rabid fanbase, you don't have to convince them of anything."

Yeah, I hinted at that in my second paragraph.

"i think you're missing the point here, which is that if you're writing music that can potentially appeal to the 15-27 age range, and you want to capture more of that range, you don't come up with something that only appeals to 66% of them."

Well yeah, but appealing to liberal ideology extends far beyond just that 66%. You now potentially gain 56% of women of all ages, 90%+/- of minorities, and are able to potentially regain a portion of potentially lost fans who may have fallen out of the Green Day demographic. I don't think you can disagree that being a politically charged band has the potential of appealing and selling to a much larger fan base than the base of a normal punk band.

"green day profited here because they tapped into the anger of the times, but they didn't fake that anger. how is it selling out to write music based on what you personally believe?"

I don't find anything wrong with writing music about your beliefs- that doesn't make you a sellout. They are selling out by cashing in on the liberal market, and leaving someone like me in the dust.





j-biebs said:
"I don't think you guarantee more record sales when you write about teenage angst at the age of 38, because how do you know the base will agree with you? "You're old! What do you know about growing up in today's world?""

see: weezer. when you have a small, but rabid fanbase, you don't have to convince them of anything.

i think you're missing the point here, which is that if you're writing music that can potentially appeal to the 15-27 age range, and you want to capture more of that range, you don't come up with something that only appeals to 66% of them. you seem to be separating the existing green day fanbase from the 15(18)-27 block of voters, when in reality they are part of the same group. you are a weezer fan. you are also a voter.

green day profited here because they tapped into the anger of the times, but they didn't fake that anger. how is it selling out to write music based on what you personally believe?
Well, Ive been listening to GD for 15 years and Ive seen them live 8 times. They have put out great albums and even fun "side-projects" (see The Network and The Foxboro Hot Tubs. I saw them as the Hot Tubs last April and there were some fans there who were in their 30s. If they lost anyone I think its because a switch in the individuals music preference.

Despite the political beliefs, the music is still great. And, theyre even better live now than back in 94. I think Billie Joe had more energy last April than he did back in 94.

This is Green Day as the Foxboro Hot Tubs. This song was a joke song they wrote for the cast of American Idiot. Check out 2:12 - 3:00:
"sorry, but i don't think green day is suddenly appealing to women of all ages due to their politics. my mother isn't going to start listening to green day just because they appeal to her liberal sensibilities. hell, i'm a liberal and roughly in the age range of typical green day fans, and i don't listen to them."

Hence the use of the word "potential".

"first of all, f*** your self-righteous b*******. they didn't leave you, you left them because you got your conservative panties in a twist. which,by the way, is simply more evidence that this supposed strategy to sell more records has backfired."

They turn their backs on a portion of the base in order to pursue a new type of base, and we are the ones who leave? How is that logically consistent? How did it backfire? Because I don't like it? Like the guy who marketed them gave a s***, American idiot has gone platinum X8, that's a pretty significant jump from Warning which went Gold.

"secondly, they cashed in on the angsty teenage market for years, was that selling out? every band has a target audience, and if they do their job right they cash in on that market. does becoming popular with a particular demographic of people equal selling out? the concept of selling out is so f****** nebulous because it's all b*******."

Yeah, the definition of selling out is b*******, but as far as I'm concerned leaving a less profitable market for another- more profitable- market is selling out. Plain and simple, they wrote American Idiot, went from a micro concept (teenage angst) to a macro concept (f*** Bush), and cashed in their billion dollar checks. In the process they left a part of their fan base behind.
HOW COOL IS THAT?
Green Day has a shitload of energy live. Up to 37 song setlist. 2-3 hr. shows. And really, the only break they take is when they play the King For A Day medley laying down. The best live band I've seen, no contest.

Kezner32 said:
Well, Ive been listening to GD for 15 years and Ive seen them live 8 times. They have put out great albums and even fun "side-projects" (see The Network and The Foxboro Hot Tubs. I saw them as the Hot Tubs last April and there were some fans there who were in their 30s. If they lost anyone I think its because a switch in the individuals music preference.

Despite the political beliefs, the music is still great. And, theyre even better live now than back in 94. I think Billie Joe had more energy last April than he did back in 94.

This is Green Day as the Foxboro Hot Tubs. This song was a joke song they wrote for the cast of American Idiot. Check out 2:12 - 3:00:

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